No ,or government

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bigsteel

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4/2/2009--Introduced.Clean Water Restoration Act - Amends the Federal Water Pollution Control Act (commonly known as the Clean Water Act) to replace the term "navigable waters" that are subject to such Act with the term "waters of the United States," defined to mean all waters subject to the ebb and flow of the tide, the territorial seas, and all interstate and intrastate waters and their tributaries, including lakes, rivers, streams (including intermittent streams), mudflats, sandflats, wetlands, sloughs, prairie potholes, wet meadows, playa lakes, natural ponds, and all impoundments of the foregoing, to the fullest extent that these waters, or activities affecting them, are subject to the legislative power of Congress under the Constitution. Declares that nothing in such Act affects the authority of the Secretary of the Army or the Administrator of the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) under the provisions of the Clean Water Act related to discharges:
(1) composed entirely of return flows from irrigated agriculture;
(2) of stormwater runoff from certain oil, gas, and mining operations composed entirely of flows from precipitation runoff conveyances, which are not contaminated by or in contact with specified materials;
(3) of dredged or fill materials resulting from normal farming, silviculture, and ranching activities, from upland soil and water conservation practices, or from activities with respect to which a state has an approved water quality regulatory program; or
(4) of dredged or fill materials for the maintenance of currently serviceable structures, the construction or maintenance of farm or stock ponds, irrigation ditches and maintenance of drainage ditches, or farm, forest, or temporary roads for moving mining equipment in accordance with best management practices, or the construction of temporary sedimentation basins on construction sites for which discharges do not include placement of fill material into the waters of the United States.
 
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rainman

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Just one more instance of Obama's administration wanting to be the Boss. First it's control, next comes new regulations then, wait for it, TAXES. IMHO

Incremental pressure applied incessantly.

RULE 8: "Keep the pressure on. Never let up."
 
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mlw

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I would think every fisherman would be in favor of clean water.

The previous administration (worst president in U.S. history), systematically tried to dismantle as much environmental protection as possible - with predictable results. We have hundreds of towns and cities across the country that "accidentally" discharge storm water (which has lots of nasty crap in it) and raw sewage into our rivers when it rains a lot. (such as happened fairly recently with Oregon City and the Willamette). We need tighter protections - no use sticking our head in the sand and wishing things were simpler.

I, for one, am very gratefully we have a smart, articulate president willing to take on the mess left by the previous idiot.
Michael
 
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HARDWOODFLOORGUY

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I would think every fisherman would be in favor of clean water.

The previous administration (worst president in U.S. history), systematically tried to dismantle as much environmental protection as possible - with predictable results. We have hundreds of towns and cities across the country that "accidentally" discharge storm water (which has lots of nasty crap in it) and raw sewage into our rivers when it rains a lot. (such as happened fairly recently with Oregon City and the Willamette). We need tighter protections - no use sticking our head in the sand and wishing things were simpler.

I, for one, am very gratefully we have a smart, articulate president willing to take on the mess left by the previous idiot.
Michael

puh-lease!!!!!crawl back under your stone in monroe,this president has only had 1 year,he still has 3 years of destruction to bring on us.
i used to live in monroe....what happened there?is there something in the water these days?used to be patriotic americans there.
smart president huh?yeah he has all the answers right?that's why were all sitting at home with no jobs right now.
 
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bigsteel

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i love clean water but thats not their purpose,,,they are gonna control every aspect of our rivers,,,can anyone say everything will be private property,,or they will make bs claims to need to protect certain animals..i just dont see anything positive,anything they want they take...sorry to be negative i just have a big dislikeness for government regardless of party..no need for them
 
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bigsteel

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example portland is one of the most liberal cities there is,,,they care so much about the environement that sewage spills alll over the willamette and they could care less,,,but bygod theyll spout their mouths about sea lions protection....
 
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mlw

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why were all sitting at home with no jobs right now.

The economy was nearly collapsed by Bush, not Obama.

I really don't understand why all thinking republicans have not fessed up and admitted that they were wrong all along. Republican policies have resulted in an economy where most of us who work for a wage are making what we were in 1967 - whereas the rich have gotten richer. Trickle down does not trickle down.

Michael
 
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Yentz

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I think you guys are overreacting a bit to this.

Anything that can help clean up our waters is good in my book. Yes, it means the government will have more control of those waters, but the fact of the matter is, it's BECAUSE the government had very little control, and the private sector had all the control is the entire reason why our waters are so terrible in the first place.

If the Government doesn't put controls in place, we just end up like we did before Mccall came in. With a Willamette river that has been completely desecrated by farmers, and private businesses.

Go watch Pollution In Paradise, to see what the Willamette was like.
 
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HARDWOODFLOORGUY

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The economy was nearly collapsed by Bush, not Obama.

I really don't understand why all thinking republicans have not fessed up and admitted that they were wrong all along. Republican policies have resulted in an economy where most of us who work for a wage are making what we were in 1967 - whereas the rich have gotten richer. Trickle down does not trickle down.

Michael

agreed,there is no good politician and bush was out for a buck....
i hate greed that's why i used to be a democrat but one day i woke up and seen the effects of democratic rule and it was not pretty.
the nazi party=democrats
kkk=democrats
2nd amendment infringement of our rights=democrats
oregon the logging state destroyed by guess who?democrats!
for 200 years we had healthy forests clean water,oregonians love their state and chose to live in the beauty of oregon(roseburg,eugene,bend,ect.)were country lovers....we don't love the city,portland makes me want to puke!
but the transplant tree hugging dirt worshipers moved in and brought their liberal ideas to our conservative state and now look at us packed in a city like sardines with a river that overflows sewage after 1/2inch of rain
(that would be the willamette)and our we oregonians better today from the liberals changes forced on us?my fishing tag last year says no!
my point is all politicians are evil but the conservatives appear to be the lessor of 2 evils....myself i'm independent but i would vote for the whole bush family before i would ever vote for another democrat.it's time for a new party to freshin things up in office but hey take the lessor of 2 evils!
obama has decided to run our car companies
our mortgage companies
our banks
and now our water district?
what next?looks like someone is power hungry and wants to run everything even though he has no experience in any of it.
we need a government that works for us not us working for the government!
 
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bigsteel

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the economy has collapsed by government period,regardless of party,,,,republican or democrat they are the same,,they dont really oppose each other.just read the lists of pork project the stimulus is funding and they just write it off as oh well its just a handful of projects..I think we need way less government now they want healthcare just look at the other sectors they run,,ie.DMV,the post office,amtrak,prisons,jails,public schools...they just throw tons of money at a non resolvable problem...yipppeeee i forgot about global warming.they tell us to cut back while they burn hundreds of thousands of gallons of gas a year to fuel their private jets...until they practice what they preach,,i dont want any of it.i recently recended my republican party status now im just independant.I am all for good clean water my heart just tells me they have other plans and ideas for this act.
 
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HARDWOODFLOORGUY

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the economy has collapsed by government period,regardless of party,,,,republican or democrat they are the same,,they dont really oppose each other.just read the lists of pork project the stimulus is funding and they just write it off as oh well its just a handful of projects..I think we need way less government now they want healthcare just look at the other sectors they run,,ie.DMV,the post office,amtrak,prisons,jails,public schools...they just throw tons of money at a non resolvable problem...yipppeeee i forgot about global warming.they tell us to cut back while they burn hundreds of thousands of gallons of gas a year to fuel their private jets...until they practice what they preach,,i dont want any of it.i recently recended my republican party status now im just independant.I am all for good clean water my heart just tells me they have other plans and ideas for this act.

i agree with everything you said!i don't think we can ever again believe in either of these parties fully or any politician but for someone to praise the current president tells me someone dont do a lot of research before voting for the most importand job in the u.s.a
 
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bigsteel

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agreed,,we need an average joe fishing guy/gal party:dance::dance:
 
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Yentz

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the economy has collapsed by government period,regardless of party,,,,republican or democrat they are the same,,they dont really oppose each other.just read the lists of pork project the stimulus is funding and they just write it off as oh well its just a handful of projects..I think we need way less government now they want healthcare just look at the other sectors they run,,ie.DMV,the post office,amtrak,prisons,jails,public schools...they just throw tons of money at a non resolvable problem...yipppeeee i forgot about global warming.they tell us to cut back while they burn hundreds of thousands of gallons of gas a year to fuel their private jets...until they practice what they preach,,i dont want any of it.i recently recended my republican party status now im just independant.I am all for good clean water my heart just tells me they have other plans and ideas for this act.



Actually, the collapse of the Economy was not related to the government. It wasn't Bushes fault, and it wasn't Obamas fault. In fact, had there been MORE government regulation, this collapse might never have happened.

It was the fault of the private sector. It was the fault of capitalism. Private bankers putting our money where they shouldn't have been is what caused the fall.

While I hate the idea of the government controlling every aspect of our lives(Read 1984 to many times), fact of the matter is, many of the projects you listed are projects that Oregonians want.

Public school. Requested by the people. Tri-Met. Requested by the people. Prisons, DMV, ODFW, etc, etc. All requested by the people in order for our society and way of life to function. The whole reason why the Obama government is pushing so hard for Health Care? Because the majority of Americans want it.


That said, the way government handles problems can certainly **** me off, and you're right. They don't practice what they preach. But we still need them, because without government, the private sector will pretty much go wild and go back to the *good ol' days* where we wiped out millions of fish, buffalo, beavers, and our fellow humans, in the name of Capitalism.
 
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HARDWOODFLOORGUY

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agreed,,we need an average joe fishing guy/gal party:dance::dance:

i agree,i think it's a good time for a woman president actually....
i mean if we would elect obama in office,our standards as low as they have ever been so it's a good time to take advantage of that.
that's not a stab at women by no means,just obama!:dance:
 
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bigsteel

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i agree with ya yentz,,,its just frustrating how every year they vote to increase their budget for all those programs,,and the more they spend on them the worst the results...
 
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chris61182

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Actually, the collapse of the Economy was not related to the government. It wasn't Bushes fault, and it wasn't Obamas fault. In fact, had there been MORE government regulation, this collapse might never have happened.

It was the fault of the private sector. It was the fault of capitalism. Private bankers putting our money where they shouldn't have been is what caused the fall.

The government played heavily into this collapse and of course the corporation's greed didn't help either. But capitalism is the cure not the disease, natural selection would weed out the corporations who didn't play smart with their money, additionally those who led their companies to ruin would have a heck of a time finding a job. Instead they're being rewarded because it's clear they know who's-who in government and can secure bailouts.

Long story short, capitalism would have ensured that these same mistakes wouldn't happen again for a very long time. Instead we never gave capitalism a chance and as a result never learned any lessons, are going further into debt, and setting ourselves up for a much bigger fall.
 
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Yentz

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The government played heavily into this collapse and of course the corporation's greed didn't help either. But capitalism is the cure not the disease, natural selection would weed out the corporations who didn't play smart with their money, additionally those who led their companies to ruin would have a heck of a time finding a job. Instead they're being rewarded because it's clear they know who's-who in government and can secure bailouts.

Long story short, capitalism would have ensured that these same mistakes wouldn't happen again for a very long time. Instead we never gave capitalism a chance and as a result never learned any lessons, are going further into debt, and setting ourselves up for a much bigger fall.

Are you familiar with what happened in the great depression? When banks fail and collapse, the ones who get hurt the worst are us. Would it have gotten rid of those lousy banks? Sure, but in the meantime, this current depression would have looked like a Golden Era in comparison.

The only way the Government played into the collapse, is that they should have stopped the CDS lending beforehand. It was pure capitalistic greed that caused this.
 
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bigsteel

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very well said chris!!!!too big to fail is BS you shouldnt be rewarded for running a company in the ground.
 
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bigsteel

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the government regulated fannie mae and freddie mac and they forced them to make home loans to people who could not possibly pay it back,,that to me is extorsion..from what i understand social security was implemented to insure the governments debt to the federal reserve.most people dont even know the federal reserve is a PRIVATE business they are not a FEDERAL institution.look at all the perks and retirement packages for government employees,,they have huge pensions the best benifits,,and the thing that gets me is they dont even produce anything,,their like the big banks they dont produce a product persee,,,thay take whats other peoples and make big promises that never work out.
 
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