Coast Fork Willamette R is getting some chinook

[TTFishon]

Coast Fork Willamette R is getting some chinook

 

[DYJ]

School me here.... How does that protect the wild Chinook in the Mac?

I do think it's cool, since I live close to that strech and I guess I am a "meat fisher" also....

 

[eugene1]

School me here.... How does that protect the wild Chinook in the Mac?

I do think it's cool, since I live close to that strech and I guess I am a "meat fisher" also....

I don't know either, unless they are going to shift all releases from the mac to the Coast fork.

 

[jamisonace]

It doesn't sound like they are shifting all releases but some of them. That would be devastating to have them shift all the releases. This would help the Mac (theoretically...I'm not sure I buy it) because less hatchery origin fish would be spawning with "wild" fish. I think it just means we'll have a significantly less chance of catching a fish on the Mac and even worse chance of catching something to eat.


Can you imagine the traffic that would shift from the Mac to the Willy? Not good. The MF and CF Willamette aren't set up with ramps and holes to fish that many people like the Mac is.

Besides, I don't want that much more competition on my home river.

 

[cobias]

I bet the landowners are going to love this. Another dumb move by odfw. They better increase the flow in summer if they do this...that water gets low and warm. Youll either have a bunch of dead salmon , or a million snaggers trying to trespass on private property. Its a total idiotic move.

And the hatch/wild mixing issue is frankly retarded. The only proof they have that it is bad for wild fish is theoretical. There are more pressing issues to wild fish than the mixing issue. Ocean conditions for one, gill netting, seals , polution, long liners...I think there is a big push to make the Mack one of those semi protected streams. If they cared , they shoudnt have made retention of uncliped steelhead legal ( dont get me started on that , i get foot in mouth ) because it makes it where people can keep wild trout over 24". And a good idea would be to quit planting pellet-heads. They suck up a lot of the food smolts eat.

ODFW is a joke. They are frankly clueless. This pattern started with the bait and dog ban on cougars and bears back in 94. So much for having a college education. They should hire older fishermen and ex game officers like the used to.

With all that said, i know where ill be anchored up in a couple of years ! ; )

 

[brandon4455]

the reason harvest of "wild" steelhead over 24 inches is because any steelhead with an adipose in the mac are a result of 2 hatchery fish spawning, the over 24 inches rule is probably to make sure people dont mistake a large redside as a steelhead and keep it.

 

[bigthackara]

this is interesting, there are some stray chinook up near the dam from time to time. Not sure how this creates a "fishery" though. The fish will kegged up below the dam like chord wood! Can you say snaggers?

 

[plumb2fish]

Awesome! Take fish from a clean river and put them into one that is so polluted that you aren't supposed to eat the fish that come from it.....BRILLIANT

 

[plumb2fish]

If it actually had anything to do with hatchery fish spawning with wild fish, they wouldn't pass the hatchery fish above the Leaburg Dam......

 

[cobias]

the reason harvest of "wild" steelhead over 24 inches is because any steelhead with an adipose in the mac are a result of 2 hatchery fish spawning, the over 24 inches rule is probably to make sure people dont mistake a large redside as a steelhead and keep it.

I don't quite get your post ? So you are assuming that the Redsides dont get over 24" ( which they do ) , yet if they do its ok to kill them in order to save those wild rainbows under 24" ????

And the two hatchery fish spawning are supposed to create an inferior run theory is absolute horse####. I would like to see solid proof of it. I have hooked two summer run steelhead that had small reformed adipose fins but I have caught and released some big true wild summers and have seen them caught and released in both the mack and Willy right in front of me...as far back as 89 ! They are there. The problem with the runs is not genes , its people illegally keeping them. It happens all the time. I found a bunch of fileted out salmon carks with adipose fins right below the duck hole on the Mack. I have seen coho kept on the slaw when there was no special retention season. Some people are brazen about it. That's a bigger problem then this so called ' gene mixing '. Especially when the steelhead are not competing with a natural wild run...if they are going to die out ? Let em die out.

This is all a ruse by ODFW and flyfishers to turn the Mackenzie into this pristine fly only stream. Mark my words. I have no problem with even protecting all of the upper river and continuing to make below Hayden fly and lure only for trout...but cutting into the hatchery salmon and steelhead ? NO WAY !


If they really cared and didn't have their head up their ----- they would make stiff punishment for keeping any fish with an adipose fin, they would patrol and crack down on flossers, cut down the ridiculous amount of planter trout they dump in there. But planting the Nooks in the coast fork ? Even people i know that dont fish were scratching their heads on that one.

Hatchery fish will spawn and prosper if they dont get caught or used for egg take. The problem is not the genes, its people killing wild fish because they are pathetic.

I started another thread on this where i put my foot in my mouth and said " why shouldnt i keep them too ? Everyone else does " Anyone that knows me knows im not like that. Everett464 has seen me release wild trout and dark hatchery chinook many times. Its just that the idiocy is so thick sometimes a guy feels like saying screw it.

How hard would it be to just strictly enforce ' No fish with an adipose fin shall be kept' And put severe fines if you do so ?

Oh well. The best i can do is release all uncliped fish and hell even some of the cliped ones when i dont want to mess with them :lol:

 

[steelhead_stalkers]

And people called BS when the whole thread about the McKenzie hatchery fish ending was started. Looks like small steps are happening to get rid of all hatchery fish to me.

 

[eugene1]

SS, you might be right, but hard to know at this point what they are thinking. The fish biologist didn't say anything about shutting down the mac to hatchery releases, but just opening up more fishing opportunities. The article did stress protecting wilds though.

Saw this in the Register Guard:
“We hope to create a little more intimate and dispersed salmon fishery,” said Jeff Ziller, fish biologist for ODFW’s South Willamette Watershed District, in a press release. “The Coast Fork is not a giant river, but it runs enough water in the springtime to provide the structure for a good spring chinook fishery.”

 

[steelhead_stalkers]

Jeff Ziller is the one pushing for the reg changes on the McKenzie and from what many are saying the one who wants to stop hatchery plants on the McKenzie. Looks to be true. If they want to create a new fishery great, just don't take away from an already good fishery and pretend like its for all of us. By the time they completely stop hatchery Springer plants on the McKenzie then they will decide that the coast fork is to warm and the fishery is not working out. He says it runs enough water in the springtime to provide good Spring Chinook fishery. Everyone that lives here knows the Springers do not return up this high in the spring but more into summer. Right at the time that the river is at its lowest level and warmest temp!

 

[JeannaJigs]

Sweet. There goes salmon fishing in the valley. I for one hate the willamette, and am glad there are Rivers north of here that get bigger runs with less pressure, because the mckenzie was crowded as hell and that's just going to make all those anglers go to two smaller systems, one of which wont be able to sustain healthy runs. Awesome idea.

Ziller is a moron on this one.

 

[rippin fish lips]

Sweet. There goes salmon fishing in the valley. I for one hate the willamette, and am glad there are Rivers north of here that get bigger runs with less pressure, because the mckenzie was crowded as hell and that's just going to make all those anglers go to two smaller systems, one of which wont be able to sustain healthy runs. Awesome idea.

Ziller is a moron on this one.

Ziller should keep every hatchery steel/salmon in the mac!! The salmon are needed on this river, as they provide excellent nutrition to the river when they die after spawning. That is one reason why these "wild" fish on this river get so big, the salmon die then white flesh floats down the river which is an amazing source of food for these fish. He just needs to take out all the STOCKER TROUT. I don't think he is making the "right" decision by "moving" 200,000 hatchery salmon into the coast fork willy, just for them to die off because of the warmer temps. And spending our tax money on the planting of 200,000 hatch springers with only a predicted return of 1,000-2,000 springers on the coast fork, hell no!! I would rather them use our tax money and plant those 200,000 smolts in the mac at leaberg, they would by far get a stronger return, and better use of the "Tax payers" money. It's like they are taking our money and throwing it right in the f.....n dumpster!!


This is a good thread, as there is many Pro's/cons on this topic. Just get rid of the pellet heads and keep all hatchery programs for steel/salmon going on this river. Hatchery salmon/steel will have less of an impact on the "wild trout" as all the pellet heads have more of an impact on them.

 

[Halfthrive]

What really sucks about Ziller is the fact that he's been eligible for retirement for years but he chooses to stick around and torment us. Last year he spent two weeks flying around in a helicopter surveying high cascade lakes for trout, with a FLY ROD. Two weeks worth. How much does a helicopter pilot charge per hour? Must be nice.

 

[jamisonace]

Yes, everyone needs to know that the MF Willamette is a terrible river and you all should never, ever, ever fish it! And stay away from the CF in 2014 too or you'll have wasted a perfectly good day of fishing!

You're welcome in advance for this exceptional bit of advice.

Sweet. There goes salmon fishing in the valley. I for one hate the willamette, and am glad there are Rivers north of here that get bigger runs with less pressure, because the mckenzie was crowded as hell and that's just going to make all those anglers go to two smaller systems, one of which wont be able to sustain healthy runs. Awesome idea.

Ziller is a moron on this one.

 

[TTFishon]

Just remember the last mile of the CF float is basically frog water. Me and FP did a CF float from hwy 58 to the main stem a couple of summers ago and it was all about rowing.

 

[steelhead_stalkers]

I would be all for trying to see if they can get a small run going but it looks like they are taking away 200,000 from the McKenzie to do it. I have seen the Coast Fork in June and not one salmon will survive trying to swim up the frog water. It looks more like small mouth bass water than chinook. Not smart!

 

[plumb2fish]

There are some springers on Mosby Creek (Row river) as well as summers on the Row and Coast Fork clear to the dams. My main objection is that these two rivers have very high levels of Mercury and PCB's and are listed in the game pamphlet as bodies of water that you are encouraged to eat very little fish from.
Anyone that truely believes removing hatchery fish(chinook) from the Mckenzie is going to do anything to help the native runs recover had better not be too attached to having these fish in the southern Willamette Valley. There are so many factors that come into play in this equation that I'm not even gonna try to list them. If hatchery plants are removed, we are writing a death sentence to "the only viable self sustaining run of spring chinook in the Willamette basin". I put that in quotes because self sustaining would mean they are not hatchery supplemented, and ODFW has been "seeding" the upper Mckenzie basins with hatchery fish for a LONG time.