WA fishing closures bring crowds to Oregon?

Echskech

Echskech

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So I was searching around to find this topic but to no success. So have a gander at this. https://nwsportsmanmag.com/bank-fis...st-steelhead-rivers-starting-in-mid-december/

With such sweeping regulation to Washington coastal fisheries is it safe to expect that oregon waters will face the pressure of migrant fishermen? These new rules regulate fishing from boats, using bait, hook types, and basically blacklist bobber dogging. Pretty well hamstring the Washington fishing guides.

Any projection as to weather oregon may follow suit and implement similar regulations as our sister state up north?

Looks like fisherman get the shaft again. 😑
 
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Snopro

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Looks like fisherman get the shaft again. 😑
The Deschutes is a great fishery. I'm sure OP anglers will adapt. Oregon should be proactive and adopt the same regulations to discourage migration from Northern steelheaders. Bump up the out of state guide fees also.

Hopefully it will decrease some of the out of state guiding pressure. It would be nice if the tribes did something to decrease their commercial catch but I don't see that happening.
 
rogerdodger

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My initial thoughts on the drastic WA steelhead changes-

1- Has anyone seen any discussion by ODFW of these sort of rule changes? I haven't. Yet.

2- Non-resident license and tags costs in OR have increased much more than resident costs in recent years, so there's that.

3- small consolation but the WA rules still allow a floating device to move between locations, but they must get out to fish.
 
Echskech

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This quote from the article made me chuckle.

“Select waters” is how WDFW initially broached the fishing-from-a-floating-device ban, but in true 2020 fashion, what emerged out the other end was a completely different animal, as all the waters were selected".

If ODFW starts to grumble about "select closures" then we'll know. 😅

Ultimately I'm on the side of conservation and if this brings the answer then I'll be damn impressed, but regardless I'll support the efforts.
 
hobster

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Yes, I imagine this will bring more pressure to the northern coastal rivers in OR. I feel for the guides, this will be crushing to them. They can still take clients out on a drift boat, just going to be a lot more challenging hooking fish from the bank. Personally, I have hooked WAY more steelhead bank fishing so I don’t care either way if OR does the same. It would suck for our guides as well, so I hope they don’t.
Bank maggot for life!
 
rogerdodger

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Yes, I imagine this will bring more pressure to the northern coastal rivers in OR. I feel for the guides, this will be crushing to them. They can still take clients out on a drift boat, just going to be a lot more challenging hooking fish from the bank. Personally, I have hooked WAY more steelhead bank fishing so I don’t care either way if OR does the same. It would suck for our guides as well, so I hope they don’t.

But also 'no bait/no scent/no barbs'.
No thanks.
 
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Snopro

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I feel for the guides, this will be crushing to them. They can still take clients out on a drift boat, just going to be a lot more challenging hooking fish from the bank.
I'm not worried about the guides. I think good guides will still get their clients on fish, and do well financially. The new regs will weed out the less effective guides who only specialize in one type of fishing like bobber dogging or fly dogging. The guides who are great coaches will be able to teach their clients how to fish, instead of just moving their gear through productive water by boat control.

Bottom line, the guide herd could use a little culling.

No bait, no barbs, no problem.
 
hobster

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But also 'no bait/no scent/no barbs'.
No thanks.
Yeah barbless would be tough with them crazy fish. I rarely use bait for steel unless it’s high OFF color water, so no worries there. And I seem to hook more without scent, don’t use that much either.
Also, you can successfully bobber dog from the bank too, so that’s not going anywhere.
Either way, I’ll be out there chasing the grey ghost this winter for sure!!
 
D

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This is horrible news for Washington and Oregon. It will most definitely create a domino affect. We can only hope that Oregon doesn’t allow fishing from non- residents to avoid crowding here in Oregon. ODFW did this back in February when Washington closed fishing altogether. If more Washington folks begin to fish Oregon rivers we will have the same problems that Washington faces.
 
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hobster

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Good point. And considering soft beads are the go to for the vast majority of steelhead fisherman now that would effect a lot of anglers
 
D

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Many of those rivers on the OP don’t offer much bank to stand on as they receive so much rain. It would be like trying to bank fish in a tidal zone. Many of the rivers are also not very accessible by foot as they run through private property. If you don’t think more Washington guys will be bank fishing Oregon you’re wrong. The coastal guys will fish Southwest Washington and the Southwest Washington anglers will fish more in Oregon.
 
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Dizzy Fisherman

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I’m talking about for the Washington anglers. More of a reply to Hobsters comment.
 
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Snopro

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I’m talking about for the Washington anglers. More of a reply to Hobsters comment. I fixed my original post by clarifying.
Makes sense. I looked at the WA regs and bait has to have scent or flavor, so if soft beads are scent free you should be able to fish them.

The WA and OR definitions of bait are surprisingly different.
 
D

Dizzy Fisherman

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Makes sense. I looked at the WA regs and bait has to have scent or flavor, so if soft beads are scent free you should be able to fish them.

The WA and OR definitions of bait are surprisingly different.
It’s been many years since I lived in Washington but when I was fishing certain rivers any soft plastic was considered bait. They may have changed that since then. I would still probably double check it.
 
hobster

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I was hypothetically stating that if they made the same changes in Oregon, soft beads would be illegal since they are considered bait here. Should have clarified that.
if they made those changes to Oregon, it would pretty much be drift fishing Corkys, tossing spoons and spinners, and bobber and jig. All barbless of course.
 
brandon4455

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have they presented any factual, unbiased science that shows this was the right move?? Or was this a good old “do it or we will sue” from the NFS and the blind fly angler followers

WDFW must know that even if they saved 50 wild fish for example, what if the habitat has limited the carrying capacity on that given stream, so those extra fish that didn’t die due to issues associated with boat traffic. Then those “extra” fish would not equate to more fish. Every stream has a carrying capacity and ocean conditions dictate just as much. Plus you know.. commercial fishing and all of that.

In certain places I believe in limiting the amount of guides because everyone and their cousin is guiding these days even for trout, so I understand form that standpoint, but you shouldn’t be taking the ability to fish from a boat. Sell a limited amount of boat passes or limit guides or something at least and let people fish from a boat of the amount of boats is a problem.

taking bait away?? Well most wild trout streams are artificial only.. and most people I know don’t ever use bait for steelhead unless plunking. So that doesn’t seem too harsh. BUT you are still going to kill fish on accident if you handle them correctly and only fish single hook artificial. No matter how hard you try.

Bottom line is, if science is showing a crash and the fishery is in peril. Close the whole thing.There Is no in between especially trying to be this nit picky about it.
Washington already doesn’t allow wild fish to leave the water so I’m not sure why they think fishing from a boat is causing a bunch of harm unless it is from jet pumps stirring up redds.

If it is about limiting people so they come in contact with less fish in general by not being able to access all water, once again this goes back to fish will still die, and the carrying capacity will still have a limit. The amount of fish saved by a regulation like this is highly unlikely to make a difference which is why Regulation like this has no place in northwest fisheries, the only thing it does is limit angler opportunity, and furthermore bunches all of the fisherman into smaller areas, which is my point in this long rant.

I think this is likely going to add more traffic to north coast Oregon rivers definitely, and I think there should be some governing done about how many of these guides or people can come down here and jump on our already overcrowded rivers.but for personal reasons obviously. I don’t think any of us want to deal with more overcrowding than we have to. already have plenty of Washington visitors even all the way down on the mid coast thanks to our pals at addicted fishing.
 
D

Dizzy Fisherman

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have they presented any factual, unbiased science that shows this was the right move?? Or was this a good old “do it or we will sue” from the NFS and the blind fly angler followers

WDFW must know that even if they saved 50 wild fish for example, what if the habitat has limited the carrying capacity on that given stream, so those extra fish that didn’t die due to issues associated with boat traffic. Then those “extra” fish would not equate to more fish. Every stream has a carrying capacity and ocean conditions dictate just as much. Plus you know.. commercial fishing and all of that.

In certain places I believe in limiting the amount of guides because everyone and their cousin is guiding these days even for trout, so I understand form that standpoint, but you shouldn’t be taking the ability to fish from a boat. Sell a limited amount of boat passes or limit guides or something at least and let people fish from a boat of the amount of boats is a problem.

taking bait away?? Well most wild trout streams are artificial only.. and most people I know don’t ever use bait for steelhead unless plunking. So that doesn’t seem too harsh. BUT you are still going to kill fish on accident if you handle them correctly and only fish single hook artificial. No matter how hard you try.

Bottom line is, if science is showing a crash and the fishery is in peril. Close the whole thing.There Is no in between especially trying to be this nit picky about it.
Washington already doesn’t allow wild fish to leave the water so I’m not sure why they think fishing from a boat is causing a bunch of harm unless it is from jet pumps stirring up redds.

If it is about limiting people so they come in contact with less fish in general by not being able to access all water, once again this goes back to fish will still die, and the carrying capacity will still have a limit. The amount of fish saved by a regulation like this is highly unlikely to make a difference which is why Regulation like this has no place in northwest fisheries, the only thing it does is limit angler opportunity, and furthermore bunches all of the fisherman into smaller areas, which is my point in this long rant.

I think this is likely going to add more traffic to north coast Oregon rivers definitely, and I think there should be some governing done about how many of these guides or people can come down here and jump on our already overcrowded rivers.but for personal reasons obviously. I don’t think any of us want to deal with more overcrowding than we have to. already have plenty of Washington visitors even all the way down on the mid coast thanks to our pals at addicted fishing
There apparently was a meeting today in Washington with WDFW, the commission, and public. Don’t know what changes if any came out of this meeting. As I understand it this rule change was made by WDFW without the knowledge or consent from their own commission. The bait ban/selective gear rule is no big deal. The real issue is not being able to fish from a boat. Not sure what they hope to achieve from these changes. Things aren’t going to get better unless people begin to relocate to another planet.
I don’t know how easily/quickly Washington guides can become licensed guides in Oregon? I honestly don’t think this will drive the WA fishing guides to Oregon. I think it will move them to Southwest Washington rivers. The Southwest anglers will then fish more in Oregon. I hope Oregon does not allow all these Washington residents in to Oregon. Wouldn’t be the best decision given the pandemic and the health of our rivers and fish.
 
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jamisonace

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Yes, I imagine this will bring more pressure to the northern coastal rivers in OR. I feel for the guides, this will be crushing to them. They can still take clients out on a drift boat, just going to be a lot more challenging hooking fish from the bank. Personally, I have hooked WAY more steelhead bank fishing so I don’t care either way if OR does the same. It would suck for our guides as well, so I hope they don’t.
Bank maggot for life!
Guides are going to hurt from this for sure. You'll see a lot of guides shut down. Many guests are older and can't get in and out of boats very easily and much of the fishable water isn't accessible once your standing on the bank. Hobster, I think you should care as a bankie because it's going to put a lot more pressure on bank spots both walk in and boat in.

There is so much effort to end sportfishing in WA and OR right now from so many angles. Expect to see much more of this in both states.
 
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rogerdodger

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taking bait away?? Well most wild trout streams are artificial only.. and most people I know don’t ever use bait for steelhead unless plunking. So that doesn’t seem too harsh. BUT you are still going to kill fish on accident if you handle them correctly and only fish single hook artificial. No matter how hard you try.

Bottom line is, if science is showing a crash and the fishery is in peril. Close the whole thing. There Is no in between especially trying to be this nit picky about it. Washington already doesn’t allow wild fish to leave the water so I’m not sure why they think fishing from a boat is causing a bunch of harm unless it is from jet pumps stirring up redds.

I agree with this, if things are that bad, shut down fishing totally on rivers with endangered wild runs and without any hatchery fish in them. For rivers with wild and hatchery fish, evaluate them on a case by case basis and set the angling rules as appropriate (also whether to adjust the approach to planting fish in them).

For me, I really only fish the hatchery run on the Siuslaw up at Whittaker, mostly with eggs and soft scented beads under a bobber. In 5 years of doing that, I've never landed a wild fish, none of my bank fishing friends have landed one while I was with them, and of the many many fish I have seen drift boats land near me, I've seen perhaps 3 or 4 wild fish released. Our STEP Whittaker trap operations encounters just a few wild fish that we pass through each year to spawn up the creek.

Of the hatchery fish that I have landed on the stretch below Whittaker creek, all were hooked in the mouth/jaw and could easily have been released, as you would expect fishing in swift green water even with eggs and/or scented plastics.

I hope that WDFW reconsiders their initial 'one policy fits all' plan, they can do much better.
 

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