Some various questions from a noob

[spmpdr]

Yesterday i went out fly fishing for the 5th time ever. I have been experiencing some difficulties with different aspects of fly fishing , I have tried every thing i can think of to correct these issues but have had no luck. So heres my list of questions:

When nymphing and using split shot on the line, My split shot flys off the line or slides up and down the line no matter how much i crush it down. How do i correct this? I have tried crushing the split shot basically as flat as a penny!!! The only way i have stopped it from sliding up and down is to tie a knot in the leader in front of the split shot, but then im jeopardizing my leader. Also when casting with split shot on the line im having a hard time getting the rod to load properly , thus resulting in sloppy cast that cause huge splashes and scare every fish in a ten mile radius!!!:shock:Any tips or tricks you can share would be great. Also should i be using some kind of scent on the nymphs/ midges/ eggs im fishing?

When dry fly fishing: I am having a hard time finding my fly on the water? Is there a trick to this ? I do have some indicators that i could use if necessary. I missed to big fish yesterday because i wasn't quick enough to set the hook. When fishing an emerger behind a surface fly do you want the emerger to sink and the dry stay on the surface? Do i put sink juice on the emerger or will it do it on its own?

Sorry for the ramble peeps, im just a little frustrated at this point and really want to catch fish on a fly rod. The river was great yesterday and everybody was landing fish but me

 

[halibuthitman]

1. no scent.... ever
2. try using parachute dry flies... they are more visible when you are a beginner
3. if you see a flash within 2 ft of where you think your fly is... set the hook
4. most missed fish on dryflies actually are the result of poor line mending and belly in your line delaying a hook set
5. don't pay attention to the guys around you... unless your gonna watch and learn
6. ditch the split shot for now, and just fish weighted nymphs
7. don't become frustrated, once you catch that first fish you have ended the beginning... and I wish I could go back to the days I casted mosquito flies poorly to tiny trout... dying to catch my first,.... you are at a very cool place in your evolution as a fisherman... ease back and enjoy it- Brad

 

[bigsteel]

hey its just the learning curve,at least you have the ambition to get er done...as far as split shot,i just tie a knot about 12 to 18 inches up from the fly then put my split shot right above the knot,and i have never had a knot fail yet.as far as casting with split shot if your using smaller flies you should be able to cast normally as you would a dry fly but if your using big heavy flies,i like to use the WATER HAUL method,,just make a few forward casts to get some line out then let your line drift down river as you keep feeding out line(as much as you need) then when your ready pick up as much of the fly line as possible and while you make a real quick pause on the forwad stroke,LET ER RIP..you should be able to shoot 30 to 40 feet of line but it takes practice.
We all have a hard time finding our fly on the water,especially using smaller flies,i just keep an eye on where the general location of my fly is and if i see a fish rise or boil near that area i will gently set the hook.also i see a lot of guys that are missing fish not because they can't see their fly but because they are setting the hook way too quick,i know its a fast reaction and ive done it before but WAIT for that fish to take your fly before you set hook.PATIENCE...

when using an emerger behind a dry you want the emerger to ride right in the surface film a few inches below the surface.

I agree with halibuthitman,ditch the split shot and use weighted nymphs,,the crookes is not a deep river by any means.GOD i love that river,,ill come over and fish it with you at the beginning of the year

NO NO NO NO NO NO SCENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[CFishRun]

Most of my experience comes from fishing the Deschutes and a few other tiny streams, but in general similiar techniques apply.

Firstly when nymphing I don't usually fish water over five feet deep (therefore no split weight is needed). I also use a tandem rig (dropper) commonly a stone fly, prince or hare's ear followed by a smaller prince/hare's ear/or other nymph. I run my dropper between 10-18" depending on what the fish are keying in on that day. The large bead head on the front of this rig will get you down plenty if you set your float/indicator at about 8'6" from the last nymph on your tandem rig. This approach fish's effectively from 3' to 6' in moderate current. It's not the most enjoyable to cast but once you get the hang of it you'll enjoy fishing it. Also, most of the fish I catch are between one and three rod lengths away from my feet. You really don't need to cast very far when using this technique. My first cast usually lands directly up stream from where I'm standing (if standing in the river) and the indicator/flies drift past me just off the tip of my rod. Getting a bite at this point is unbelievable and not uncommon. The success of this rig hinges more on line control during the drift then it does on casting distance. But even bad line control which will pull your nymphs off the bottom will catch fish and if done at the proper moment like stopping the drift before a snag can entice a strike from trout lying just beyond or directly in front of the snag (rock, log, ford fender etc), and keep you out of harms way.

Dry fly fishing is a completely different ball game and understanding "drag" becomes quintessential to your presentation. You won't catch fish with poorly presented dry flies, especially on fish that have seen the same hopper or caddis ten times since the sun came up that morning. The only way to get the drift right is to have someone who knows what they're doing show you on the water, otherwise the learning curve is steep. Get some floatant and spray or rub it on your fly so it "rides" higher in the water and you should have no problem seeing your fly. Also, remember to use your roll cast to dry the fly, just don't cast over your fish and don't smack the water.

My last tip, is to go to the river and ask someone who is catching fish if you can shadow them. You'll learn a lot. Sometimes the best way to learn is to stop fishing.

 

[BigShayne]

Just wrap the line around and twice through the split shot then cinch it down. I really like the parachute advice, also my extremely small midge patterns have a neon green butt right before the turn of the hook. Seems to work great.

 

[spmpdr]

1. no scent.... ever
2. try using parachute dry flies... they are more visible when you are a beginner
3. if you see a flash within 2 ft of where you think your fly is... set the hook
4. most missed fish on dryflies actually are the result of poor line mending and belly in your line delaying a hook set
5. don't pay attention to the guys around you... unless your gonna watch and learn
6. ditch the split shot for now, and just fish weighted nymphs
7. don't become frustrated, once you catch that first fish you have ended the beginning... and I wish I could go back to the days I casted mosquito flies poorly to tiny trout... dying to catch my first,.... you are at a very cool place in your evolution as a fisherman... ease back and enjoy it- Brad

Great advice much appreciated . Fishing has always come pretty easy to me and ive had some good luck along the way as well....thats where the frustration comes from. Fly fishing is really an art i have discovered it makes fishing much more complex but the rewards are better.

.

 

[spmpdr]

Most of my experience comes from fishing the Deschutes and a few other tiny streams, but in general similiar techniques apply.

Firstly when nymphing I don't usually fish water over five feet deep (therefore no split weight is needed). I also use a tandem rig (dropper) commonly a stone fly, prince or hare's ear followed by a smaller prince/hare's ear/or other nymph. I run my dropper between 10-18" depending on what the fish are keying in on that day. The large bead head on the front of this rig will get you down plenty if you set your float/indicator at about 8'6" from the last nymph on your tandem rig. This approach fish's effectively from 3' to 6' in moderate current. It's not the most enjoyable to cast but once you get the hang of it you'll enjoy fishing it. Also, most of the fish I catch are between one and three rod lengths away from my feet. You really don't need to cast very far when using this technique. My first cast usually lands directly up stream from where I'm standing (if standing in the river) and the indicator/flies drift past me just off the tip of my rod. Getting a bite at this point is unbelievable and not uncommon. The success of this rig hinges more on line control during the drift then it does on casting distance. But even bad line control which will pull your nymphs off the bottom will catch fish and if done at the proper moment like stopping the drift before a snag can entice a strike from trout lying just beyond or directly in front of the snag (rock, log, ford fender etc), and keep you out of harms way.

Dry fly fishing is a completely different ball game and understanding "drag" becomes quintessential to your presentation. You won't catch fish with poorly presented dry flies, especially on fish that have seen the same hopper or caddis ten times since the sun came up that morning. The only way to get the drift right is to have someone who knows what they're doing show you on the water, otherwise the learning curve is steep. Get some floatant and spray or rub it on your fly so it "rides" higher in the water and you should have no problem seeing your fly. Also, remember to use your roll cast to dry the fly, just don't cast over your fish and don't smack the water.

My last tip, is to go to the river and ask someone who is catching fish if you can shadow them. You'll learn a lot. Sometimes the best way to learn is to stop fishing.

Some more great advice!!!!thanks....... I do fish a tandem setup as suggested. I fished an egg pattern with a wooly bugger dropper, a double egg set up with split shot , an egg pattern with an orange shrimp dropper, prince nymph tandem. I seemed to get the most hits off of the double egg pattern because of the white fish spawn i think. as far as the line control part of it i am basically side drifting , i have not tried casting directly upstream and stripping the line with the drift , ill try that next time.

As far as dry fly fishing goes, i am using a floatant to no avail , I still can't see the fly, most of the tiime i get a good drift on the fly i believe, i get the belly out of my line first thing and get it upstream from where i believe my fly is drifting. I am going to ask someone if i can tag along with them and just them fish next time i go out. Should i take a guided lesson?

 

[spmpdr]

Just wrap the line around and twice through the split shot then cinch it down. I really like the parachute advice, also my extremely small midge patterns have a neon green butt right before the turn of the hook. Seems to work great.

Thanks for the tip with the split shot. I might just not be catching on here but what works great about the small midge with the neon green butt? Is that a pattern your recommending?Great name by the way, Shane is my name as well , My mom named me that because of the old western cowboy movie called Shane.

 

[BigShayne]

Thanks for the tip with the split shot. I might just not be catching on here but what works great about the small midge with the neon green butt? Is that a pattern your recommending?Great name by the way, Shane is my name as well , My mom named me that because of the old western cowboy movie called Shane.

allows me to see it better out in the river. Yeah same here with the name. I always have people saying, "Shayne, come back Shayne!" makes me want to slap them. spelling is different because "I'm special".

 

[Van]

Also when casting with split shot on the line im having a hard time getting the rod to load properly , thus resulting in sloppy cast that cause huge splashes and scare every fish in a ten mile radius!!!:shock:Any tips or tricks you can share would be great.

Casting a full load of nymphing rig isn't very easy for a noob, i know from first hand experience. It has been my experience that if the mechanics of your cast are off you are going to make a big splash with your line loaded up with so much gear. I was instructed to first try roll casting until i had a better handle on casting with weight on.

Have you had instruction from a certified caster? If not, it really helps a lot. It is pretty easy to get the mechanics of the cast off, thus causing problems further down the line. The guys at The Patient Angler are great and very helpful. If you are one of those go it alone guys that is cool, however taking a few lessons helped me enormously and has made my fly fishing a lot more enjoyable.

 

[Irishrover]

You might want to consider ditching the split shot. I like using "Twistons" if I use weight at all. They come in a package that looks like a paper match package. they are thin flat pieces of lead that you twist onto your line so the weight isn't concentrated in one tiny spot. I'm not real good at explaining things in the writen form but I'll give this a try. When you cast nymphs it is much different than a dry fly. To have fewer tangles you need to have more of an open loop so that the weighted fly and the weight on the line don't come into contact with your flie line and create one big tangle.

A simple and effective way to cast a nymph set up is to let you line drift down stream (you will need current for this). At the bottom of the drift arch the rod back up stream. This loads the rod and shoots the nymph set up up stream. Then you let the nymph drift by you and do it again. As the nymph comes close to you on it drift down stream raise your rod tip, as it passes lower you rod tip. Mike Dooley a retired Deschutes guide showed me how to do this quite sometime ago. I still use this method and I spend more time fishing and less time being frustrated with tangles.

I hope we can hook up this spring there are a few of us going to be headed to the Crooked and the Deschutes.