Salmon egg mortality study/egg cure ban

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xtremenorthwest

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Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife
Contacts:
Bruce McIntosh (503) 947-6208
Richard Hargrave (503) 947-6020
Jessica Sall (503) 947-6023
Fax: (503) 947-6009
Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife
For immediate release
Dec. 16, 2009

ODFW finds popular salmon bait cure harmful to fish
Tests show some cured eggs killed juvenile salmon and steelhead

SALEM, Ore. – A recent study by the Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife confirms some commercially-available cured fish eggs – a popular salmon and steelhead bait – are harmful to juvenile salmon and steelhead. ODFW released the results of its study today.

ODFW and Oregon State University scientists tested a random sample of commercially-available cured eggs and found that some juvenile fish died after ingesting some brands. Specific mortality levels varied among products and ranged from 0 to 30 percent.

In a second round of studies at OSU, researchers identified sodium sulfite as the ingredient causing the fish to die.

“We’ve already talked with several manufacturers and we’re encouraged by their commitment to solving this problem,” said Bruce McIntosh, ODFW deputy administrator of inland fisheries.
“Our emphasis will be on informing anglers, guides and other manufacturers about the risks sulfites pose to juvenile fish.”

While the recent research showed some cured eggs killed juvenile fish, ODFW researchers cannot predict whether this has a significant effect on the overall health of salmon and steelhead populations.

“We cannot extrapolate the data from this study to predict what impact, if any, the ingestion of cured eggs by juvenile fish has on the final size of the adult population,” said Shaun Clements, ODFW researcher.

Anglers often cure salmon eggs to preserve them and to add fish-attracting scents. Some anglers use their own egg cure recipes, while many others use commercially available products. While salmon eggs have been considered safe and popular bait for decades, it’s only been since the 1980s that sulfites have been a common ingredient in egg cures.

The egg cure issue was brought to the attention of ODFW in April 2008 and testing began the following month.

Researchers selected random samples from commercially-available eggs to conduct the research. ODFW has coordinated with the product manufacturers, who have cooperated throughout the study and supplied ingredient lists to the researchers.

Editor’s Note: Attached to this news release is a summary document of the study that was done by ODFW and OSU.
Summary Document Link https://acrobat.com/#d=FO2DdEgyQVdZ6hBMvmwNjg


ODFW is thinking on no more that 25% of sodium sulfite can be use in a cure.
 
R

rainman

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And did they just happen to mention that these studies were done in a hatchery, on hatchery smolts ?? Not very comparable to wild fish in their natural environment. IMO

From Oregon Live 12-16-09--"The Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife has been researching the preservative's use and is nearly ready to release results showing cured baits with the highest sulfite levels can quickly kill tiny fish, called smolts and pre-smolts, in a hatchery setting"... Bait cure found to kill small salmon, steelhead | Bill Monroe - – OregonLive.com

ODUM continues to use hatchery settings and/or fish, as if it's comparable to Mother Nature. How idiotic. IMO
 
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livin2fish

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I have been told that sodium sulfite is used in the aquariams to get the fish feeding again, does anybody know for sure ?:think::confused:
 
K

Kodiak

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The number of smolts it kills is relatively small, only 30% of the smolt that injest the eggs die. I talked tothe guy that did the study, and as far as his methods they are as sound as you can get in a controlled situation. Not all the smolt would eat the eggs ( they took uncured eggs more readily which is verry interesting to me) and no adult fish in the study were tested. Sodium Sulfite throws the stomach enzimes out of whack, about 60% of the smolt will adjust and never have problems again. There other more effective chemicals to use besides Sodium sulfite, I think we should all look at something different.
 
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osmosis

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Trapped inside my own mind.
guys to my understanding they fed the smolts 100% nothing but cured eggs for a month straight, and even injected sodium sulfite solution directly into the body cavity with needles.. what would you expect to have happen!?

They stopped feeding them their regular food pellets cold turkey and fed them ONLY cured eggs or raw eggs.

with that crooked and slanted of a test I'm suprised more didn't die, in fact it makes me believe egg cures are not as hard on the fish as I had already thought.

This is an insane test with absurd parameters, what smolt in the river eats 100% ONLY cured eggs for a month straight.
They had this test done with rediculous terms and conditions to get the answer that they wanted.

I am flat out ashamed that ODFW would be this crooked towards the folks that pay their paycheck instead of going after bigger problems like mills and farm runoff.
 
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beaverfan

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The number of smolts it kills is relatively small, only 30% of the smolt that injest the eggs die. I talked tothe guy that did the study, and as far as his methods they are as sound as you can get in a controlled situation. Not all the smolt would eat the eggs ( they took uncured eggs more readily which is verry interesting to me) and no adult fish in the study were tested. Sodium Sulfite throws the stomach enzimes out of whack, about 60% of the smolt will adjust and never have problems again. There other more effective chemicals to use besides Sodium sulfite, I think we should all look at something different.

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:
 
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beaverfan

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guys to my understanding they fed the smolts 100% nothing but cured eggs for a month straight, and even injected sodium sulfite solution directly into the body cavity with needles.. what would you expect to have happen!?

They stopped feeding them their regular food pellets cold turkey and fed them ONLY cured eggs or raw eggs.

with that crooked and slanted of a test I'm suprised more didn't die, in fact it makes me believe egg cures are not as hard on the fish as I had already thought.

This is an insane test with absurd parameters, what smolt in the river eats 100% ONLY cured eggs for a month straight.
They had this test done with rediculous terms and conditions to get the answer that they wanted.

I am flat out ashamed that ODFW would be this crooked towards the folks that pay their paycheck instead of going after bigger problems like mills and farm runoff.

Have you called them to ask them if your understanding is correct. ODFW is full of problems but I doubt there dumb enough to do a test they way your saying.

edit: i'm calling them right now, will report whatever I hear.
 
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beaverfan

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I just got a hold of Jessica Sall and discussed the test method. Osmosis you were kinda close. They had several tanks of fish. One tank of smolts was fed fish pellets, one tank uncurred eggs and one tank cured eggs. They were fed the same food for 23 days. If they were in the pellet tank they received only pellets and so on. She also said the vast majority of fish that died in the cured egg tank died within minutes of ingesting usually only one or two eggs. The study is going through the peer review phase and that may take some time. They had several research consultants look through there data and no mistakes were found and they came up with same conclusion. It will not be difficult to eliminate sodium sulphite from cures. And if there's even a chance it helps the smolt survive it's a good thing.
 
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xtremenorthwest

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Just to let people know that I have been work very closely with the Biologist on the bait cure issues.
 
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beaverfan

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I've talked to both Jessica and Bruce Mcintosh and I am on bored with them. The study shows that uncured roe has no impact and fish pellets have no impact and that cures do have an impact. Not all smolts are sensitive to sodium sulfites, but the ones that are die very soon after ingesting eggs cured with cures that contain 30% or higher sodium sulfite. From what both Jessica and Bruce said many of the local commercial cure producers are on board with them and willing to work on finding an alternative. That is a good thing. The test was done in a controlled environment yes, but it was done very well.
 
A

Anyfishisfine

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I'm hoping that an egg cure ban is overstating the solution. Reading other forums (lots of discussion about this right now), it sounds like there was no mortality with borax, and none where the sodium sulfite was less than 25% of the cure. Of course we need to wait until the study is published to separate good info from bad, but it sounds like traditional Borax cures are not the issue, and might be still allowed. I hope so anyway.
 
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beaverfan

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Ya they made that clear to me over the phone that they weren't planning on banning all bait cures.
 
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xtremenorthwest

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From my understanding ODFW did test individual cures and do have individual results. I filed a public records request for that information.

Testing of bait cures...
I also asked if they test any other chemicals or was it just sodium sulfite? I also ask to see more testing if possible with the different chemicals used in bait cure to keep are fish safe. I will keep asking until I get my information so I can help keep the fish safe.
 
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fourgotten

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I'm hoping that an egg cure ban is overstating the solution. Reading other forums (lots of discussion about this right now), it sounds like there was no mortality with borax, and none where the sodium sulfite was less than 25% of the cure.


A study in the 70s suggests that borax cures may have other unintended effects on fish, including reduced growth and weight.

OTOH, perhaps a new study would disprove that... I'd be totally up for seeing that tested...
 
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Mrs. Kodiak

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When you ask for studies you may not like the results. I would highly suggest looking around your kitchen for things to cure your eggs. There are preservitives and bite stimulants everywhere in there. My husband is constantly rooting around the kitchen for things for his eggs.
 
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fourgotten

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When you ask for studies you may not like the results.

Absolutely correct; however, whether or not we like the results, we still need to know. If we're destroying our environment through our seemingly-harmless activities, then we need to know so that we can resolve the problem.

I would like to think that none of us would knowingly use baits that kill fish or elements in their environment... after all, we love fishing... it would be self-defeating to destroy that which we love.
 
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